SHRUTI KRANTI MINUTES OF THE MEETING HELD ON 18TH NOVEMBER 2012

[DRAFT]

MINUTES OF THE MEETING HELD ON 18TH NOVEMBER 2012 TO EXPLORE ESTABLISHING A SANSKRIT SCIENCE SOCIETIES CONSORTIUM [S3C]

In person participants:

1. Shri.J.Sreenivasa Murthy - jsreenivasamurthy@gmail.com
2. Shri.Sreenivasa Varakhedi - shrivara@gmail.com
3. Shri.G.N.Srinivasa Prasanna - gnsprasanna@iiitb.ac.in
4. Shri.Seshadri Kaipa
5. Shri.B.V.K.Sastry
6. Shri.Om Vikas - dr.omvikas@gmail.com

Web Participant

7. Smt.Leela Mahendale

What?, Why?, How? & Where? issues were discussed.

WHY?

• Future Society is emerging as a knowledge society that will be knowledge predominant and voice interactive.
• Technology is bringing newer tools to augment creativity and facilitate faster and wider human networking.
• Multiple linguistic communities are reducing in number and creative aspects in native Language.

WHAT?

Amongst the living languages Sanskrit has well-developed voice based linguistic frame work. There is enormous literature on research findings which may help the Technologists to develop effective tools and techniques.  However the research finding in other languages will also be taken into consideration and thus evolving an integrated approach for technological development.

It is therefore proposed to develop voice centric human centered computing and communication for smooth knowledge networking amongst various linguistic communities.

HOW?

Already there are a number of research groups active in this direction.  There is enormous literature in Sanskrit unseen by modern linguists and technologists.

• Attempt will be made to consolidate the available tools and techniques and integrate them to develop more complex systems for linguistic networking.

• Mimicking human behavior and networking across a variety of cultures and communities is a complex Problem and ambitious technological goal to achieve.  Attempts could however be made to succeed in steps in collaborative mode.

That is why consortium approach is suggested. The activities may focus on three broad areas:

Technology

Education &

Proliferation

WHERE?

The consortium may have worldwide members and contributors.  They may be individuals, Institutions, Societies and Corporates.

Normally a number of Sanskrit societies exist with varied names and objectives such as

1. Sanskrit studies to integrate in the School Curriculum for Innovation, Discipline and Global Harmony.
2. Sanskrit studies to digital unite various linguistic communities.
3. Sanskrit studies to contribute to speech enabled knowledge management.
4. Transcreation of Sanskrit Science knowledge to dovetail with modern science & technology.
5. Interdisciplinary research integrating cognitive science, knowledge technology, psychology, sociology, literature, economics, management etc.
6. Emerging Sanskrit informatics – Technology Development and Knowledge Management.

After preliminary discussion, the following suggestions were made;

VISION: Shruti Kranti - connecting people in knowledge society

MISSION:

Technology:

To Develop standards for interoperable technologies and processes

Education:

To identify research problems and develop research methodologies to share with prospective researchers and to encourage various research groups to collaborate and produce products and services to benefit people.

Proliferation:

• To encourage SSS to organize training/orientation programs for heads of institutions, faculty and students.  
• To develop instructional material, laboratory kits, etc for distribution to schools and colleges
• S3C to organize annual international conference in different countries, in India with a gap of minimum two years.

1. The consortium may be registered as S3C [Sanskrit Science Societies Consortium] with the above vision and mission statements

2. To begin with, a group ID may be created.  Since Google requires atleast six characters we may have group ID s3c.shrutikranti@gmail.com.  Domain name may also be asked for www.s3c.org

3. Smt.Leela Mahendale may be entrusted to resolve issues related to formal registration as society/trust and prepare bye-laws.

4. The core promoters for the proposed S3C may tentatively include the following and may be approached for their formal consent.

Shri.BVK Sastry

Smt.Leena Mahendale

Shri.Gopalaswami [Ex-Election Commissioner]

Shri.Om Vikas

Shri.R Nagraj [Infosys]

Shri.Sadgopan

Shri.V.N.Jha

Shri.Sampadanand Mishra

Smt.Radha Bhallabh Tripathi

Shri.Sashi Tewari [WAVES]

Shri.Nachiketa Tewari [IITK]

Shri.Narayana Murthy

Shri.Abdul Kalam

Shri.Suresh Krishna [TVS]

Shri.Venu Srinivasan [TVS]

Shri.R.Ramanujan

5. The promoters from India may be requested to give a seed corpus contribution of Rs.10,000/- or more whereas promoters from abroad may be requested to give $500 or more as seed corpus contribution.

6. After registration, membership subscription in 3 years block may be as follows:

Three years block subscription for Corporate in India	Rs.1,00,000/-
Three years block subscription for Institution in India	Rs.30,000/-
Three years block subscription for Individual in India	Rs.1,000/-
Three years block subscription for individuals from abroad	$ 100.

Life Membership may be considered only for individuals as follows

Rs.30,000/- [India]

$ 1000 [Abroad]

Initial Group Members

Venkatakrishna Sastry <sastry.bvk@gmail.com>

Shrinivasa varakhedi <shrivara@gmail.com>

Leena Mehendale <leena.mehendale@gmail.com>,

Ramanujam CDAC/B <rama@cdac.in>,

Gnsprasanna@iiitb.ac.in" <gnsprasanna@iiitb.ac.in>,

Kavi Mahesh <drkavimahesh@gmail.com>,

LD Singh <ld.singh@fluidyn.com>

H.S. Puttanna" <puts555@yahoo.com>,

Roshan Makam <mvrmakam@yahoo.com>,

Guru prasad <sim_guru@yahoo.com>

J.Sreenivasamurthy - jsreenivasamurthy@gmail.com

Shrinivasa Varakhedi - shivara@gmail.com

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Comments --

Venkatakrishna Sastry <sastry.bvk@gmail.com>	11/19/12
to Om, shrivara, me, rama, gnsprasanna, drkavimahesh, ld.singh, puts555, mvrmakam, sim_guru, jsreenivasamur., shivara, Om

Namaste

1. Thanks for a good summary of the minutes of meeting.

2.  Do we prefer to keep  the name as 'Shruti-Science -Society / Sanskrit -Science-Society /Samskrutham -Science - Society'- the legal full name ?

3.  Some of the members - they have been in the deliberation; they are yet to get actively involved or even see the big picture. the copying of meeting invitation was to pool resource persons. The next step of financial's and active participation needs to be rechecked please.

Regards

BVK Sastry 

Om Vikas <dr.omvikas@gmail.com>	11/22/12
to Venkatakrishna, shrivara, me, rama, gnsprasanna, drkavimahesh, ld.singh, puts555, mvrmakam, sim_guru, jsreenivasamur., shivara, Om

My views are given below in black italics.

Regards .....   Om 

On 20 November 2012 11:00, Venkatakrishna Sastry <sastry.bvk@gmail.com> wrote:

Namaste

1. Thanks for a good summary of the minutes of meeting.

Thanks. 

2.  Do we prefer to keep  the name as 'Shruti-Science -Society / Sanskrit -Science-Society /Samskrutham -Science - Society'- the legal full name ? 

 

We need not hesitate to keep the term Sanskrit / Samskrutam - science society. Mad'm  Leena  Ji  may kindly discuss and conclude.

 

3.  Some of the members - they have been in the deliberation; they are yet to get actively involved or even see the big picture. the copying of meeting invitation was to pool resource persons. The next step of financial's and active participation needs to be rechecked please.

This is an initial draft. Core group may again discuss and finalize the list of possible promoter members for registration , and only those need to be approached.

Venkatakrishna Sastry <sastry.bvk@gmail.com>	11/22/12
to Om, shrivara, me, rama, gnsprasanna, drkavimahesh, ld.singh, puts555, mvrmakam, sim_guru, jsreenivasamur., shivara, Om

Namaste

I concur with Dr. Om Vikas notes below.

My preference in the order of choice for legal full  name, and brand creation as identity   is : 

(1)  Shruti (Gives the traditional flavor and brining to main stream the technical word and unique branding anchor . And in popular usage, as in any case, like W3C, it would end up as S3  [- just like Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi becomes MG ! ] No need to feel shy or toe the line of others.

(2) Samskrutham [- keeps focus on Indian Linguistic process] 

(3) Sanskrit. [ - The way world of oriental schools has projected tradition and called the vedic tradition - A given name , different from the original name].

I would go by Leena ji's wisdom.


Regards
BVK Sastry

Venkatakrishna Sastry <sastry.bvk@gmail.com>	11/28/12
to Om, shrivara, me, rama, gnsprasanna, drkavimahesh, ld.singh, puts555, mvrmakam, sim_guru, jsreenivasamur., shivara, Om

 Namaste

This is in furtherance of S3 society formation and related discussions.

1.  Here is a link which plans to provide the Traditional Nirukta (vedic words) online.
http://www.andhrabharati.com/dictionary/sanskrit/index.php

2.   Utility of online availability of such works is not disputed. To that extent, the use of available technology for scholars and general audience is highly appreciated. Such resources are aplenty across the globe - both in India and West, each following their preferred conventions. The convention of TITUS database at Harvard may not map to the Kyoto-Harvard of Japan or Omkaranada plan or Baraha/ Nudi / Brahmi  / ISCII et al. This causes many challenges in portability and search of texts, leading to issues of TEXT AUTHENTICITY / DOCUMENT INTEGRITY VALIDATION.

These issues when placed in security perspective, banking et al would be serious national technological issues; but when talked in the context of Samskrutham, it would be considered as ' least significant / irrelevant challenges by linguist over the mighty monarchs of Technology. 


3.      The link provides the classical text Nirukta in choice Indian  languages by transliteration, as facilitated by the software used / supported by the browser. Here are the challenges that come up, if one takes time to study each page- by transliteration and read for the Samskrutham voice.

           The point desired to make is this, in relation to the question Why Shruti in relation to Samskrutham :: Voice Primariness in relation to Devanagari script primariness and anchor, both of which are far   superior approaches compared to the current roman script/ phonetic model of human interface. Unless this primary modeling of human voice -language communication paradigm is solved and mapped , the design of even simple text-editor / a word pad will carry inherent genetic defects of design (- call it the Karma of script anchor).   : 
            Writing of Samskrutham in ALL Indian Scripts does not necessarily BRING out the One Hundred percent TRUE PHONETIC VALUE as DESIRED / DESIRABLE by use of DEVA-NAGARI SCRIPT with DIACRITIC MARKING (used for Vedic).

            The inherent challenge related , so subtle yet overlooked and approximated in current Techno -linguistics, carried forward as an unquestioned 'God like ' assumption is stated as below:

2-a) The scripting standard of VOICE in DEVANAGARI SCRIPT can be TRUELY EQUATED - REPRESENTED - TRANSPOSED - MACHINE STANDARDIZED , by each character and conjunct combination. (Yes, it works to a large extent, statistically; but exceptions are aplenty. Therefore a more primary approach of voice to visual as script would mark the definition of a research problem. This is the debate of ropaakshar -shadaakshar-vedakashar  and lipi-shaastra).

2-b)    The Diacritic marking system on Roman alphabet is a PERFECT MATCH for the TRUE PHONETIC of DEVANAGARI script and /or Other Brahmi derived Indian Language scripts. And , Therefore, the ROMAN SCRIPT anchored standards with SCRIPTING PRIMACY can be a good tool for Indian Language Technology development.  (This is a European /Colonial inheritance to India + Technologists unquestioned Standards platform hypothesis. This is NOT reviewed in its proper perspective of Non-Roman script initiatives / Indian Language Initiatives. S3society needs to address this. ).

2-c)   The representation of phonetics of human voice across indian languages uses
different scripting conventions; and along with that subtle changes in scripting conventions by langauge tag, there is a subtle flavor of language in the < script applied for a language writing context>. This is an issue that is NOT properly addressed by Indian Language specialists in the schema of Samskrutham- Prakrutham- Apabhramshas -Desha bhashas . This is a badly handled topic in social linguistics by indologists.  Both models need a thorough review for a proper adoption to human-machine context. This is an exercise of technology appropriate for language diversity needs.

3.   Looking back at the history of such electronic texts of tradition in digital devices has a history of at least fifty years ! Right from DOS days,  Non- Roman  scripts have fought for their space in digital devices ( as they had found in print media and type writer devices). The mapping / outlay of type-setting / typewriter keys was unique to each language and was human controlled / Linguist  defined.   

  Post 70's with the technology-market- explosive growth, the lead of  Roman script standards /English like language approach has continued unabated , as a default -defacto acceptance by developers-researchers and thrust on consumers. This work which started from the limited desktop operation has now extended to cyber space , consuming every domain of human communication operations : be it education, or enterprise, defence or social governance.

The fall out of this is steam roll march of technologist over linguist : Techno -linguist defining how Language representation should be done in the technology devices, thus shaping the social future of language -communication interface.  The current language usage including English, have undergone multi-morphed changes  due to the society where interactions are complex by the factors of humans-machines-devices complexities . If one were to identify just the social shades of english ( leave alone other language mixes) , the diversity could be mind boggling. The proficiency of  english of the college / adolescent youth on SMS will be of no use in appreciating even a good columnist writing in a current day English news paper ! What to speak of classical literature.

While many get mesmerised over the show of language on a technology device, many do not go to explore the deeper impact and damage these are brining along with it for the future of Languages- Voices and Traditions.

Time that an initiative like S3 takes a look at these scenarios. Many are happy to amass wealth for several future generations in anticipation that they do need it ! But these 'wealth-visionaries' forget to be the 'welfare- visionaries'  by neglecting to answer the question 'Why Wealth? Why Technology ? 

I rest my input here and aloow you to have your contempaltion please.

Regards

BVK Sastry

Venkatakrishna Sastry <sastry.bvk@gmail.com>	11/30/12
to Om, shrivara, me, rama, gnsprasanna, drkavimahesh, ld.singh, puts555, mvrmakam, sim_guru, jsreenivasamur., shivara, Om

Namaste

1.      This is further inputs on why S3C initiative is important, critical and relevant as an India initiative. The love of a value/ Samskrutham  needs to translate in to action in defending attack on the distortion / destruction of the value. The technology side is simply pushing its juggernaut engine, and is not waiting for any of our response or  approval. If we ned to defend and find a proper place for Samskrutham appropriate technology, then it becomes our proactive work, Same thing applies to Hindi /Marathi / Tamil /Telugu - every non-english like language, which tries to re-mold itself in to the architecture of english like /Roman alphabet standard phonetics and script model -standards technology.

Please dont get back to me telling :Machines is all about 0 and 1 ś, signals and processes. If it were that much alone, the digital technology would have been happy with punch card devices. The key point in growth of IT is an upward look from numeric computation to Language oriented communication,: move from Numeric Data  to Human Society Linguistic data processing and hoarding.

The machines are not designed as 'human brain processing the languages The reverse is being addressed : To re-engineer and train the brain to work on the design of the machines. The Indian Traditional initiative to map the right 'Bhashaa-Chandas vijnana'to the current Digital Language Technology Architecture is critical. This is  S3 effort.  

2.      The attached  survey document provides the shift of Data-Storage from analog to Digital mode.

URL: http://www.wcu.edu/ceap/houghton/readings/tech-trend_information-explosion.html

         The dangers of Big-Data management are already surfacing.  I am looking at this geo -technology impact from the perspective  of human language dynamics and communications, in a larger historic perspective. The erroneous, distorted human language ( script and voice) mapping in tech- devices and short  consideration in standards is going to be detrimental to human language-culture- connectivity and continuity across generations . This is more critical for Samskrutham / Vedic schools. No amount of Temple centric deliberations will bring out a solution to this Tech-attack. 


This is like  the difference between  'loving a living person'( which calls for a live active support) and loving  a long dead person'  by garlanding and erecting a street-statue and garlanding once a year. The way Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi is loved and honoured as the Father of Nation !  The traditional slang would have  been allowing parent to die miserably and celebrating the funeral on grand scale. Timing, Scale of investment, Direction and Speed are critical at this point for the S3 effort.


Regards

BVK Sastry

Venkatakrishna Sastry <sastry.bvk@gmail.com>	12/5/12
to Alka, Om, shrivara, me, rama, gnsprasanna, drkavimahesh, ld.singh, puts555, mvrmakam, sim_guru, jsreenivasamur., shivara, Om

Namaste

Here are some more inputs highlighting why S3 initiative should pick up speed  now.

1.   The attached file shows neurobiology related research studies on speech production  related complexities. The nuances of this issue are of critical importance in encoding vedic accents and voices for speech related standards deliberation in Human Machine Spoken system modeling.

The future directions pointed here can be used to pick up threads on 'Sanskrit for Computers / Representation of Vedic voice-script in digital media / Voice Primary Language Architecture  needed for Shruti Kranti upgrade./ Indian languages as Non-roman script -Non english like languages in Computational linguistics researching. (Some of these will be doctoral study topics at Yoga-Samskrutham University and PG projects).

2.  Thanks to Alka Irani; Euro-Asia collaboration and outreach possibility through Alka Irani, to tap resources at Vivek Nagpual - See file Attached providing contacts of IIIT   and Delhi based teams.

3.   We from India that was Bharath are still left with a slim opportunity to take leadership  in the global arena of IT to CT (Beyond BT / LT / E- Governance talk )  using the Samskrutham Human resources already in ICU phase in major institutions. The path seems to me to be   upgrade paradigm of Human Languages in Digital domain - with Voice Primary approach; simulating a human paradigm of Spoken systems of communication. This will benefit (a) all Non-Roman script + Non-English like Languages; (b) Help Spelling mode  English language developments to advance in to the foray of Spoken solutions beyond IVR .

     This is the current global relevance of Samskrutham for Computers - a three  decade old motivation revisited. Samskrutham defines the Human language process architecture of Thought transformation to communicative expression as speech in all languages. This is one of the major theme topics of investigation and research from the platform at  Yoga-Samskrutham University, USA, as my initiative.

Looking forward for your needful help.

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